To preface this, I leveled 3 midgard characters mostly through groups in BGs before the xp nerf before trying this solo run. Only did Nisse's and Cursed Tomb once solely to complete the quests. I leveled a skald and warrior to 20+ and an RM to around 15. All 3 leveled decently quickly, even a little too quickly on some occasions and never really had any trouble keeping up to date on quartermaster gear on them although none have actually achieved a complete set with jewelry included. Despite how fun the early level BGs have been thus far, I don't see them carrying momentum very long after the first initial wave after the full release and wanted to do what I can to help fine tune the PVE side of things for later on down the road if/when it's not so easy to level through BGs as well as for general PVE enjoyers and soloers alike.
I am not generally a solo PVE enjoyer but I do enjoy group PVE/Raids but I'm happy to do these solo experiments for science and to hopefully provide some kind of actual useful information to build off of. With that said, Albion is the realm I chose for this because it's the one I'm most familiar with and a Paladin for the same reason. Normally I would use a s/s spec and try to find groups but decided to try the 2h route knowing I would be 100% solo and only self-buffed.
The Start
Level 1 Highlander Paladin in Cotswold
I immediately checked just south of Cotswold and it didn't look good, iirc there was only spriggarns and brownies that were just slightly too high of a level so I ended up going north of Cotswold to the bandit camp. As a brand new naked level 1, there was no shot killing a yellow. They hit me for 8 while I hit them for 1. However there were blue bandits around that were easy to kill but lowish in quantity.
Level 2
I stuck around the bandits until I leveled again as most were blue & yellow. In the process I found an orange 1h weapon and was 2 shotting blues and able to kill yellows. By the time I hit level 3 I gained 5 ROGs in total.
Level 3
At level 3 I found an orange 2h and decided to check the spriggarns/brownies again and respecced real quick. Tried to kill a yellow and got wrecked. Went back to 1h and was chaining yellow/blues no problem. By level 4 I had 8 ROGs, 3 of which were different weapons.
Level 4
At level 4 I decided to continue south following the river towards the Prydwen Keep cemetery thinking maybe I could kill sprites/drakes/skeletons or something, however there was nothing really worth killing or that I could kill. The Legionaires in the cemetery were purple and goblins east of Prydwen Keep were also purple. I continued following the river toward PKB. I found a small camp of blue/yellow faeries with a random brownie in it and purple drakes off to the side. Decided to stick around and farm the faeries for the next level. I gained 5 ROGs between 4 and 5.
My solo 1-10 experience
My solo 1-10 experience
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Re: My solo 1-10 experience
Level 5
At level 5 I started to make my way back towards Cotswold following the road from PKB to the north. I checked the boulderlings and they were red/purple and very sparse. Kept going north to the skeleton hill which the giant skeletons were blue/yellow, however I continued to Cotswold for a respec but not before detouring through all the farm fields which sadly were virtually empty. I saw 3 grey sows. Wrapping back around towards Cotswold where I started, bandits were grey/green but the recruiters were purple. I sold all my ROGs and bought the full quartermaster gear + a 2h in Cotswold leaving me with 10 silver and 47c.
From here I set out North of Cotswold again heading towards Castle Sauvage via staying near the road. Found small groups of poachers, mostly grey but a couple blues. A little bit further along with CS in view I found a purple dwarven priest and his 2 purple converts. I continued east past CS to the first camp of dragon ants. They ranged from blue to red. Naturally I tried an OJ first. Surprisingly I absolutely slaughtered it finishing with 100% HP.
At this point I started trying to pay more attention to xp gains but regret not recording more specifics. I was able to chain pull anything blue to orange - prioritizing OJs and had little to no downtime. OJs were giving about .7 bubs a kill, yellows about .5 and blues about .3, and the coin drop seemed to range between 17-30 copper that I noticed. I gained 3 ROGs between 5 and 6.
Level 6 At level 6 most ants became blue with an occasional OJ here and there, with a few greens and greys. I decided to take a look at the other camps nearby and proceeded south/southeast. The eastern most bandit camp was mostly red and purple with occasional OJs. Same story for all the other bandit camps though one did have a couple blues and yellows. I believe what few spirits and snakes that roamed in between were also yellow/blue though I did come across 1 OJ spirit and killed it. It gave me about .4 bubs. With all the bandit camps being aggressive and no taunt or other means of ranged pulling I continued south towards Mithra.
The ant camp I came across just north of Mithra ranged between blue and red with the majority being yellow/blue. I checked the area between the road and Mithra and it was pretty barren. The druids south of Mithra were few and purple.
The demons around DF ranged between yellow and purple but there wasn't many. Found a yellow conned named skeleton behind DF. His name was Gormley and he dropped some red conned plate greaves for me. Rotting zombies south of DF ranged between blue and red but pretty low density. There was also just a few waterlogged corpses in the river that were red and purple.
Everything between PKB, the guard tower north of PKB, Mithra and DF is either grey or completely barren. The boulderlings just north of PKB are now OJ to Purple but there's very few. From here I crossed PKB towards Salisbury Plains.
Boulderlings on the southeast side of the bridge are also OJ to Purple and there is few. Found a filidh camp with 2 named purples, Aithne Con and Filidh Elfenna. Normal filidhs ranged between blue and orange.
The bandit camp west of PKB was mostly grey/green with a couple blues and 1 purple named Mostram. River drakes south of Prydwen Keep and in the river are purple.
After checking out everything between the southside of PKB and Salisbury plains, I opted for the filidh camp as it was the closest.
OJs were giving 352 exp or about .4 bubs. Yellows were giving 320 exp or about .3 bubs. Blues were giving 160 exp or about .1 bubs. I chain farmed these no problem to level 7 prioritizing OJs. I gained 9 ROGs leveling 6 to 7 making for 22 total so far...I'm pretty sure.
Level 7 I recalled back to Cotswold to respec again and sell, I was then at 59 silver 18 copper.
Decided to recheck the cemetery...Legionaires were still purple. Also noticed bunch of zombies in the field northeast of Prydwen Keep I didn't recall seeing earlier...it was also night time. Are those always there and I missed them or only spawn at night? If it is the latter, do the other fields also spawn zombies at night? They ranged from green to yellow at level 7.
Boulderlings were now yellow and orange but I continued onward to Salisbury. Checked the river racers and they were yellow/OJ to me. The river ants were purple. I decided to just stay there and farmed to level 8. OJs gave 845 xp or about .4 bubs. Yellows gave 768 xp or about .3 bubs. Coin drops seemed to range between 36 copper to 74 copper.
NO ROGs were dropped at all by the river racers. There was one brownie that spawned in the camp for some reason and it did drop 1 ROG for me. Do only humanoids drop ROGs? Can't recall any of the other few animals I had killed up to this point dropping any ROGs either.
From here I set out North of Cotswold again heading towards Castle Sauvage via staying near the road. Found small groups of poachers, mostly grey but a couple blues. A little bit further along with CS in view I found a purple dwarven priest and his 2 purple converts. I continued east past CS to the first camp of dragon ants. They ranged from blue to red. Naturally I tried an OJ first. Surprisingly I absolutely slaughtered it finishing with 100% HP.
At this point I started trying to pay more attention to xp gains but regret not recording more specifics. I was able to chain pull anything blue to orange - prioritizing OJs and had little to no downtime. OJs were giving about .7 bubs a kill, yellows about .5 and blues about .3, and the coin drop seemed to range between 17-30 copper that I noticed. I gained 3 ROGs between 5 and 6.
Level 6 At level 6 most ants became blue with an occasional OJ here and there, with a few greens and greys. I decided to take a look at the other camps nearby and proceeded south/southeast. The eastern most bandit camp was mostly red and purple with occasional OJs. Same story for all the other bandit camps though one did have a couple blues and yellows. I believe what few spirits and snakes that roamed in between were also yellow/blue though I did come across 1 OJ spirit and killed it. It gave me about .4 bubs. With all the bandit camps being aggressive and no taunt or other means of ranged pulling I continued south towards Mithra.
The ant camp I came across just north of Mithra ranged between blue and red with the majority being yellow/blue. I checked the area between the road and Mithra and it was pretty barren. The druids south of Mithra were few and purple.
The demons around DF ranged between yellow and purple but there wasn't many. Found a yellow conned named skeleton behind DF. His name was Gormley and he dropped some red conned plate greaves for me. Rotting zombies south of DF ranged between blue and red but pretty low density. There was also just a few waterlogged corpses in the river that were red and purple.
Everything between PKB, the guard tower north of PKB, Mithra and DF is either grey or completely barren. The boulderlings just north of PKB are now OJ to Purple but there's very few. From here I crossed PKB towards Salisbury Plains.
Boulderlings on the southeast side of the bridge are also OJ to Purple and there is few. Found a filidh camp with 2 named purples, Aithne Con and Filidh Elfenna. Normal filidhs ranged between blue and orange.
The bandit camp west of PKB was mostly grey/green with a couple blues and 1 purple named Mostram. River drakes south of Prydwen Keep and in the river are purple.
After checking out everything between the southside of PKB and Salisbury plains, I opted for the filidh camp as it was the closest.
OJs were giving 352 exp or about .4 bubs. Yellows were giving 320 exp or about .3 bubs. Blues were giving 160 exp or about .1 bubs. I chain farmed these no problem to level 7 prioritizing OJs. I gained 9 ROGs leveling 6 to 7 making for 22 total so far...I'm pretty sure.
Level 7 I recalled back to Cotswold to respec again and sell, I was then at 59 silver 18 copper.
Decided to recheck the cemetery...Legionaires were still purple. Also noticed bunch of zombies in the field northeast of Prydwen Keep I didn't recall seeing earlier...it was also night time. Are those always there and I missed them or only spawn at night? If it is the latter, do the other fields also spawn zombies at night? They ranged from green to yellow at level 7.
Boulderlings were now yellow and orange but I continued onward to Salisbury. Checked the river racers and they were yellow/OJ to me. The river ants were purple. I decided to just stay there and farmed to level 8. OJs gave 845 xp or about .4 bubs. Yellows gave 768 xp or about .3 bubs. Coin drops seemed to range between 36 copper to 74 copper.
NO ROGs were dropped at all by the river racers. There was one brownie that spawned in the camp for some reason and it did drop 1 ROG for me. Do only humanoids drop ROGs? Can't recall any of the other few animals I had killed up to this point dropping any ROGs either.
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Re: My solo 1-10 experience
Level 8
I decided to look just south of West Downs and move east towards the river. It did not yield much. Most stuff is either purple with a couple reds, such as the grove nymphs. Very seldom found a blue or yellow. Mares were OJ, stallions red and they were few and spread out. Other animals were also mostly red. Decided to head back across the road to the bandit camp north east of West Down and find the camp is mostly OJ with an occasional yellow and few greens.
I chose to stay here to level 9. OJ bandits were giving 1408 exp or about .3 bubs and coin drops ranged between 45 copper and 1 silver 3 copper. I only gained 3 ROGs.
Level 9 I TPd back to Cotswold to respec and sell. Now at 1 gold 37 silver 94 copper.
Checked the Legionaires at the cemetery...again. Still purple. Continue back to Salisbury Plains.
The camp of grove nymphs southish of West Down is now oj/red. Druids nearby were yellow/OJ with a few reds mixed in. Random animals such as boars/mares/stallions/adders now ranged between yellow and red.
Basilisks are purple as well as the tomb raiders and slavemasters along the river coast to the east. The grove nymph camp just south of them along the river was also all purple and there was a random goblin looking thinking who was purple named Vagdush. Decided to go back to the oj/red nymph camp.
This is the first time I noticed a camp bonus in affect. OJs gave 3,379 exp (563 20%/20% camp bonus). Decide to try soloing a red nymph and it went down easy. Gave the same amount of exp as OJ. 2,816 base exp (100% cap) with 563 camp bonus (20%/20%) or about .3 bubs. Coin drops ranged between 1 silver 1 copper and 1 silver 72 copper. Noticed the camp bonus dipped very slightly occasionally losing .25% to .50% camp bonus. Only gained 2 yellow ROGs from oj/red mobs between levels 9 to 10.
I chose to stay here to level 9. OJ bandits were giving 1408 exp or about .3 bubs and coin drops ranged between 45 copper and 1 silver 3 copper. I only gained 3 ROGs.
Level 9 I TPd back to Cotswold to respec and sell. Now at 1 gold 37 silver 94 copper.
Checked the Legionaires at the cemetery...again. Still purple. Continue back to Salisbury Plains.
The camp of grove nymphs southish of West Down is now oj/red. Druids nearby were yellow/OJ with a few reds mixed in. Random animals such as boars/mares/stallions/adders now ranged between yellow and red.
Basilisks are purple as well as the tomb raiders and slavemasters along the river coast to the east. The grove nymph camp just south of them along the river was also all purple and there was a random goblin looking thinking who was purple named Vagdush. Decided to go back to the oj/red nymph camp.
This is the first time I noticed a camp bonus in affect. OJs gave 3,379 exp (563 20%/20% camp bonus). Decide to try soloing a red nymph and it went down easy. Gave the same amount of exp as OJ. 2,816 base exp (100% cap) with 563 camp bonus (20%/20%) or about .3 bubs. Coin drops ranged between 1 silver 1 copper and 1 silver 72 copper. Noticed the camp bonus dipped very slightly occasionally losing .25% to .50% camp bonus. Only gained 2 yellow ROGs from oj/red mobs between levels 9 to 10.
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Re: My solo 1-10 experience
Level 10
Here is the last 2 screenshots I took just before logging off.
It took 4 hours and 48 minutes to solo from 1-10 and I earned 1 gold 92 silver 20 copper.
Conclusion
While it certainly wasn't the best experience, it was far from being my worst. I went into this with no real plan whatsoever, just tried to kinda go about it through the lens of a new player logging in for the first time. However it's not entirely accurate because while I'm far from a classic purist or even remember half of what it actually looked like back then, I still have a pretty good idea of where to look in regards to my current level for things to kill and that saved me a lot of time even if there was nothing worthwhile when I got there. A newer player probably wouldn't have the first idea where to check, and an experienced player can't really tell them where because everything is pretty out of whack.
Levels 1 through 5 were surprisingly pretty simple and didn't feel too time consuming, perhaps that's just because I got lucky with RNG and got an early oj weapon. In general leveling was pretty easy once I actually found a place to kill things all the way to 10. My downtime was actually pretty minimal concerning health regen, serious lack of endurance though but that is expected. However while it was easy, it really started to feel slow after level 5. I haven't done the math on the amount of time it took between levels but it definitely started to feel more and more painful and by level 10 I couldn't wait to be done.
I also never really found any camps that would be group worthy. Most of the camps I ended up at would be good for a duo or 2 solos at best really. Along with things being out of place or straight up missing a constant pattern was low camp density pretty much everywhere.
ROGs started off at a good rate but seemed to fall off considerably between 6-10 and it sucked that animals didn't seem to drop ROGs at all. However the type of ROGs I was getting seemed to flow pretty well with my character though it does kinda suck getting 1 handers when you're 2 handed, or getting slash weapons when you're crush ect. and jewelry seems to have a significantly lower drop rate.
Coin drop from a solo perspective seems okay at first but doesn't really scale well and seems downright abysmal when you think about splitting it even with 1 person. I'm pretty sure the majority of what I did earn, like 90%, was through selling ROGs I wasn't using.
If I were to do it again I could probably shave off 60-90 minutes knowing what I know now and not taking time to write down notes and granted my RNG was the same and I used the same class. Paladin seemed pretty sturdy, I have no idea about other classes but I could chain pull reds at level 9 no problem and very very little downtime.
Suggestions
A serious look needs to be taken on mob placements and camp densities as well as their level scaling. There should be a lot more camps and a lot more mobs in the ones that exist, but the camps shouldn't range between greens to reds in a single camp.
Personally I do not care about replicating mobs placements according to classic standards. I think you guys should pick mobs that fit the geography and general classic area lore and create your own camps and place them in a way that it streamlines to higher levels the further you get from Camelot/Gothwaite. For example the bandit camps next to cotswold being focused on 1-3 or so, and as you move towards Castle Sauvage and the ant camps place something for level 4-5 and then have the ants for 5-6 and the bandit camps between the ants and Mithra be 7-8 and the stuff around Mithra be 8-10.
Do a similar thing for moving south of Cotswold where camp level gradually rise as you near Prydwen Keep and PKB pushing you towards Mithra. Perhaps make a custom kill quest chain to streamline 1 through 10 that ends by leading you to the Mithra quest where you could then have a choice to pursue the Mithra quest with a group, or continue on a quest chain that pushes you to Salisbury and then the forest for Keltoi or Black Mountains into Tepoks. Hell, even throwing in some custom named mobs that parody names and whatnot and maybe drop a specific item along with ROGs would be cool to throw into camps and give a little more incentive for old world leveling.
I would happily reroll characters and test leveling paths to help make leveling as a solo or group much easier. I still like to grind a little for level and coin/ROGs. I don't like not knowing where to go, and I think most people actually feel that way as well. RVR and Dungeon leveling is pretty much figured out aside from balancing numbers but the old world leveling routes could use a lot of work. I think finding a balance of proper level mobs and camp sizes that feel good, that feel big and plentiful and have intuitive progression without ruining immersion or seeming broken could be done relatively easily - on paper, anyway.
Ending Words
Thank you so much for providing such an amazing server and work in progress for us to play around in and hopefully help shape a little. It's been a lot of fun for the most part and the stability has been amazing, probably one of the best, if not the best I've played on in terms of connection.
If there's something specific you'd like me to test please let me know! Whether it's leveling a particular class, scouting particular areas at specific levels, killing certain mobs for a specific duration ect ect please reach out and I will help! I do intend to keep better track of numbers, drops ect. in future tests.
It took 4 hours and 48 minutes to solo from 1-10 and I earned 1 gold 92 silver 20 copper.
Conclusion
While it certainly wasn't the best experience, it was far from being my worst. I went into this with no real plan whatsoever, just tried to kinda go about it through the lens of a new player logging in for the first time. However it's not entirely accurate because while I'm far from a classic purist or even remember half of what it actually looked like back then, I still have a pretty good idea of where to look in regards to my current level for things to kill and that saved me a lot of time even if there was nothing worthwhile when I got there. A newer player probably wouldn't have the first idea where to check, and an experienced player can't really tell them where because everything is pretty out of whack.
Levels 1 through 5 were surprisingly pretty simple and didn't feel too time consuming, perhaps that's just because I got lucky with RNG and got an early oj weapon. In general leveling was pretty easy once I actually found a place to kill things all the way to 10. My downtime was actually pretty minimal concerning health regen, serious lack of endurance though but that is expected. However while it was easy, it really started to feel slow after level 5. I haven't done the math on the amount of time it took between levels but it definitely started to feel more and more painful and by level 10 I couldn't wait to be done.
I also never really found any camps that would be group worthy. Most of the camps I ended up at would be good for a duo or 2 solos at best really. Along with things being out of place or straight up missing a constant pattern was low camp density pretty much everywhere.
ROGs started off at a good rate but seemed to fall off considerably between 6-10 and it sucked that animals didn't seem to drop ROGs at all. However the type of ROGs I was getting seemed to flow pretty well with my character though it does kinda suck getting 1 handers when you're 2 handed, or getting slash weapons when you're crush ect. and jewelry seems to have a significantly lower drop rate.
Coin drop from a solo perspective seems okay at first but doesn't really scale well and seems downright abysmal when you think about splitting it even with 1 person. I'm pretty sure the majority of what I did earn, like 90%, was through selling ROGs I wasn't using.
If I were to do it again I could probably shave off 60-90 minutes knowing what I know now and not taking time to write down notes and granted my RNG was the same and I used the same class. Paladin seemed pretty sturdy, I have no idea about other classes but I could chain pull reds at level 9 no problem and very very little downtime.
Suggestions
A serious look needs to be taken on mob placements and camp densities as well as their level scaling. There should be a lot more camps and a lot more mobs in the ones that exist, but the camps shouldn't range between greens to reds in a single camp.
Personally I do not care about replicating mobs placements according to classic standards. I think you guys should pick mobs that fit the geography and general classic area lore and create your own camps and place them in a way that it streamlines to higher levels the further you get from Camelot/Gothwaite. For example the bandit camps next to cotswold being focused on 1-3 or so, and as you move towards Castle Sauvage and the ant camps place something for level 4-5 and then have the ants for 5-6 and the bandit camps between the ants and Mithra be 7-8 and the stuff around Mithra be 8-10.
Do a similar thing for moving south of Cotswold where camp level gradually rise as you near Prydwen Keep and PKB pushing you towards Mithra. Perhaps make a custom kill quest chain to streamline 1 through 10 that ends by leading you to the Mithra quest where you could then have a choice to pursue the Mithra quest with a group, or continue on a quest chain that pushes you to Salisbury and then the forest for Keltoi or Black Mountains into Tepoks. Hell, even throwing in some custom named mobs that parody names and whatnot and maybe drop a specific item along with ROGs would be cool to throw into camps and give a little more incentive for old world leveling.
I would happily reroll characters and test leveling paths to help make leveling as a solo or group much easier. I still like to grind a little for level and coin/ROGs. I don't like not knowing where to go, and I think most people actually feel that way as well. RVR and Dungeon leveling is pretty much figured out aside from balancing numbers but the old world leveling routes could use a lot of work. I think finding a balance of proper level mobs and camp sizes that feel good, that feel big and plentiful and have intuitive progression without ruining immersion or seeming broken could be done relatively easily - on paper, anyway.
Ending Words
Thank you so much for providing such an amazing server and work in progress for us to play around in and hopefully help shape a little. It's been a lot of fun for the most part and the stability has been amazing, probably one of the best, if not the best I've played on in terms of connection.
If there's something specific you'd like me to test please let me know! Whether it's leveling a particular class, scouting particular areas at specific levels, killing certain mobs for a specific duration ect ect please reach out and I will help! I do intend to keep better track of numbers, drops ect. in future tests.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.
Last edited by Karmai on Tue Aug 23, 2022 7:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
Re: My solo 1-10 experience
I would have to disagree with your statement of "too easy sometimes" in terms of PvE/Solo exp. Judging by your pics, it took you roughly 6 hours to get from 1-10. Assuming you also took a bathroom break and whatnot, still entirely too long. Most players would not enjoy having to spend 20-30 hours getting 1-50.
PvE (open-world mobs) have never been a fav among DAOC players (in my exp). This game has stood the test of time due to its unique 3-realm RVR concept and is its foundation for continued play. "Tuning" BG's to be more accommodating and balanced is what is needed for sustainment, however, that does not go without saying PvE aspects are much needed. I just think it's going to need to revolve around World Bosses, repeatable dungeons/quests, and unique or low-level mini-bosses for lower levels to clear for gear. Most DAOC PvE players enjoy raids, but only so much before the craving for PVP of some level begins.
PvE (open-world mobs) have never been a fav among DAOC players (in my exp). This game has stood the test of time due to its unique 3-realm RVR concept and is its foundation for continued play. "Tuning" BG's to be more accommodating and balanced is what is needed for sustainment, however, that does not go without saying PvE aspects are much needed. I just think it's going to need to revolve around World Bosses, repeatable dungeons/quests, and unique or low-level mini-bosses for lower levels to clear for gear. Most DAOC PvE players enjoy raids, but only so much before the craving for PVP of some level begins.
Re: My solo 1-10 experience
This was in reference to the BG leveling when I was getting full levels without enemies even being in my clip range. I haven't been in them since they toned it down though.
This was my first real try at the PVE perspective and just chose solo because it's easier to keep track of things and it's typically the part that hurts the most on those nights you just can't find a group. I do agree that the time taken is far too long but a good chunk of it was just running around looking at things, and some jotting down brief notes and that is why I mentioned if I did it again I could probably shave off at least an hour, but even then that would feel too long imo. To keep the time as accurate as I could I would log off before I afk'd, even if it was just for 2 minutes.
But yes, I actually agree with you that at the end of the day it's mostly about the end game RVR, but getting there often sucks, and I don't see low level BGs being incredibly active months after release to level alts through, but maybe I'll be wrong. However if I'm not wrong I'd like to help preemptively assure there is a way to get to end game in a reasonable amount of time even if you're solo. To do that, actual playtesting and feedback is required, even if it's not fun at this given time.
Re: My solo 1-10 experience
Thank you for this detailed write up.
1-10 Questing experience has been developed and will go in the next major reboot.
1-10 Questing experience has been developed and will go in the next major reboot.